Have you never heard of 'Innocent until proven Guilty'? (Universal Declaration of Human Rights Article 11). He so far has not been found guilty of anything.

If he is guilty, it is plainly obvious that prison is not the place for him, but a mental institute.

If he is not, then he should be left alone (and should reconsider some of his less than normal acts)

Actually the operative law here is the Constitution of the United States and the laws of the State where said offenses occurred. Jackson's not going to be tried in Beligium.

As to personal opinion, I will express my own wether you deem it correct or not. You haven't held your's in check so go hump someone else's leg. I'm not going to be on the jury, or write any media reports, so what I believe is not going to directly affect his case.

As for the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, that's YOUR holy mantra, nothing, I repeat nothing trumps our Constitution in this country. Any attempt by anyone to force us into dumping it in favor of some scrap of UN paper had better have a shitload of amored divisions to back it up.

We will not be governed by any other people. Not the UN, not Europe, and sure as Hell not you.

Get over it.

Oh, and frederico, it sure would be nice if some other countries on this planet would follow your precious Article 11.

Show trials are so played out.

Hey Fred, I see you have been traveling around dropping your turds all over the place.

Why don't you step away from the computer, add up all the time you spend trolling web sites, and get a part time job with that time and send the money to Ethiopia?
K?

And by the way, we like to eat animals around here (They're made of meat!), work hard and reap the rewards (we're not selfish, we share with friends), and are all pretty content with our lives (but are constantly working to improve them).
You have no peers here.
You are fun to play with, however, so please don't go away.

EnJOY your Tofurkey next week and make sure to count your blessings.

The USA is a member of the UN therefore has to stick to it's rules. If they don't then they will have sanctions brought against them.

As the USA is currently worried about it's failing economy and industries such as steel, this would be worse for them than us.

I do wish that every country would stick to the Declaration actually. It would lead to a better world. However as that is not happening, we have to find other ways of trying to enforce it. (NOT THROUGH SENDING TROUPS AND BOMBS).

I know you enjoy eating animals. I am saying that that is wrong, that is all. Why should we as humans think that we have the right to eat another animal? Because it isn't as clever as us? No, they have abilities that we don't have too. We should allow animals to live freely and without torture too.

It always takes about 6 or so posts before i recieve the 'why don't you get away from your computer' comment. The reason for that is because no-one in the world spends all day and all night out campaigning. And actually, i have a business which i run. Most of my profits do go to charity.

Also, i will not be celebrating thanksgiving as i am British, so don't celebrate it. Instead, i shall be going to an anti-vivisection demo.

Frederico,

"Eating animals is worng". There you go, being all judgemental and "morally superior" again. But you mean it in a completely non-snobbish way, I'm sure.

Eating animals is wrong according to whom? Why were we created as omnivores if we weren't supposed to have meat in our diet? And what about pure carnivores - they eat meat, but they are somehow wrong as well?

Like I said - you are the worst form of snob - one who beleives that your ideas, shared by the smallest fraction of the population, should be forced on everyone for wht you consider the "good" of us all.

Still waiting for that list of successful utopian governments, by the by. I now your busy demonstrating and all, but it seems like you should be able to provide us with dozens of examples right off the top of your head, what with you wanting us to switch the planet over to that form of governance and all. And, as an added question, perhaps you can enlighten us on who would run this world utopia? The UN? Perhaps you should spend a little time reading about the graft, corruption, and atrocities committed by UN "administrators" before you give them they keys to your life. Just a thought, of course.

Hey, Fredrico, I'll see your sanctions and raise you three megatons.

Seriously, who's going to enforce those sanctions? the French?

Fred is so self depreciating that he spells "I" as "i". Very telling. Ayn Rand and Freud would have a field day with him!

We are omnivores through choice now. We can live on a vegan lifestyle if we choose. Carnivores cannot eat a vegan diet, beacause they live in the wild. (They can't pop down to the nearest shop and buy a vegan meal). Also, animals such as Lions etc... don't have a great enough level of thought in order to make moral decisions. We do.

It is not a case of me being superior, it is a case of people making the wrong choices because they do not know the facts. (Read Peter Singer's Animal Liberation for information).

Also, as you ask such a stupid question like the 'Carnivores eat meat so why can't we?', do you really think that I have not had the question before and I am going to change my views because of it? I have heard more arguments against veganism, which I have argued successfully against than you can imagine. Normal people such as my friends have made the right choice now, and they have all become vegan because they realised that they were making the wrong moral choice.

If you think that because I think that because you are ignorant of the facts that i am a snob, then you are wrong. Instead you are even more stupid than i previously thought.

Ahhh, yes - so now we see the other great aspect of "utopianism" - anyone who doesn't agree with you is "stupid" and "immoral".

You are an idiot, Frederico. We are not omnivores by choice - there are parts of our diet that MUST come from animal products. Even if carnivores could pop down to the local shop for a tasty vegan treat, they would be ill advised to do so. Feed a carnivore nothing but veggies, and you will soon have a dead animal.

And I really question your "normal friends" if they agree with you.

Such blinding, ideologically driven declarations are a pretty good example of why you guys side with the religious fanatics - you are fanatics yourself. You describe anything you believe as "fact", and then dump on anyone who disagrees.

Oh, yeah - I'm STILL waiting for the list of vegan utopian societies that we need to emulate. Amazing to me that you leftists all argue exactly the same way - call things facts that are opinion, selectively carve out the piece of an argument that supports your argument, and the running away or ignoring any question that you can't answer. If it wasn't for the fact that your tone is slightly more mature than Harmonia's, it would be impossible to tell the 2 of you apart.

Oh, yeah, 1 more thing - as I mentioned in a previous comment (the 3rd or 4th one where I asked for your long list of utopian societies); I'll be happy to go toe to toe with you from a credentials standpoint, especially where medicine is concerned.

The mere thought that the following are true is laughable.

"And actually, i have a business which i run. Most of my profits do go to charity."

Any business that throws away MOST of it's profits will not be a business for long, what, do you sell t-shirts from your mom's basement?

"Normal people such as my friends have made the right choice now, and they have all become vegan because they realised that they were making the wrong moral choice."

All,....ALL? Unless you held a gun on them or your circle of friends is about the number of two, that is just plain bullshit. You hugely inflate your influence on other people. You do have one effect.

After reading you for a couple of minutes I feel like killing something. RED MEAT............must kill and consume FLESH!!!!!!

Knock it off Fred, if a friend of mine nagged me about something like that, he wouldn't be a friend for long. I have a fair number of vegetarians on my mothers side of the family, life long and their health problems aren't fairy tales, there are real consequences to crossing nature, like rickets and calcium loss for example. And they aren't the worst ones.

Stop confusing a dietary choice with a moral position, it makes you a fool.

Also,

"The USA is a member of the UN therefore has to stick to it's rules. If they don't then they will have sanctions brought against them."

Feel free, the UN relys on America for everthing from 40% of it's budget to all it's heavy airlift capability. Those asshole can't wind their own watch without US military advice.

Our economy is weak? I take it you don't read newspapers much, it's rebouding explosively right now, while yours still limps like a eunuch with a saltpeter IV. Your nations would implode if they attempted anything like that. You don't understand shit about money if you believe they won't.

You stick your chin out a lot. Now go take a nap and contemplate the cause of your latest verbal beating child.